2 Rafale Per Month: Dassault Seeks Full Control of India Facility, Promises Speedier Production

Dassault Aviation, the French company behind the powerful Rafale fighter jet, has its eyes on a bigger piece of India's growing aerospace industry. They've made a bold move, offering to start building Rafales right in India – but there's a catch. Dassault wants full control of its existing Indian partnership, Dassault Reliance Aerospace Ltd (DRAL).

The Promise: Faster Jets for India​

Why does Dassault think this is a good deal for India? They claim that with full ownership, they could ramp up production and build two Rafale jets every month at their Indian facility. That's huge! If they keep that pace, India could get all 114 jets it wants for its upcoming fighter jet competition in just five years.

A Reality Check​

Hold on a second, says a defense analyst. He points out that Dassault's factory in France only managed to produce 13 Rafales in 2023, even though they aimed for 15. Could they really do so much better in India? Analyst also thinks that Dassault might be able to build even more jets (around 25 per year) in other countries.

Politics and Timing​

There's also the matter of India's upcoming elections. The official request for companies to compete for that big fighter jet contract probably won't happen until after the elections. This adds another layer of "wait-and-see" to the whole situation.

The Bottom Line​

Dassault wants to bring more investment to India's defense industry. But, there are questions! Can they really build jets as fast as they say? And, when will India even officially start that big jet fighter competition? India's government and air force will have a lot to think about as they weigh Dassault's offer against other options.

 

[beencensured]

Waste of money. Astra 3 and Uttam radar makes Rafale yesterday's technology.

 

[desigandu]

If India decides to do Rafales for MRFA (I have reservations) then Dassault must guarantee (with severe penalties) full TOT, F4 version and future upgrades, Indian weapons and sensor integration, domestic production (with indigenous suppliers) of at least 12 (1st year, rising to 18 and then 24 by year 3) within 3 years of contract signing and all planes in 5 years thereafter, on a fixed upfront price...I would suggest against 100% Dassault control, and require a JV say with TATAS of 49%, so we can have a long term player along with HAL...Of course Dassault will promise everything but we must be careful how we structure the contract and ensure not only commercial, but also technical, speed, cost guarantees including by the French Government (with TOT and Export Controls)....In the past we have done a poor job with Mirage 2000, Su-30 MKIs and we did not have a spine, hopefully now we do and must drive a good deal with national interest in mind.

 

[shivkumar sinha]

Bharat must reject this clever proposal of Dassault. This is a clear conspiracy of Dassault to keep all the technologies within the company based in Bharat. This will not boost any indigenous ecosystem in aerospace industry.Non starter . Better to order 36 Rafales and scrap MRFA for good. Keep focused on Tejas Mark-2 and AMCA.

 

[sanket]

wow Dassault a establihed player promising 25 jets per year production when they itself struggling to produce 15 per year , Second if India is Going to pay for ToT under Make in India how it will benefit if India pay for ToT since 100% ownership will b with Dassault in DRAL . There should b either Pvt Indian player stake Holder or it should b produce with HAL. if Dassault gets Full ownership of DRAL how Tech will b Transfered to India.

 

[Shiva]

This is detrimental in long run to India.
In the name of speed of production, India cannot lose private defense industries to foreign countries.
Especially this industry is with full of politics in the geopolitical arena

 

[Baiju Bhaskaran]

Just order another 36 Rafales and scrap the entire MRFA process. Concentrate on Tejas and AMCA.

 

[NSR]

In Telugu we call this ruse - "Nakka Jitthulu" which means Fox tricks.

Dassault is trying every which way it can to avoid transferring any TOT or full production to India and its HAL since it won L1 bidder award. It reneged on all commitments put in winning L1 bidder status.
Do not fall for France/Dassault/Safran tricks at all.

Better to invest that $30+ billions massively in Indian own programs like Tejas IA, Tejas Mk2, TEDBF, and AMCA.

It must be a RED LINE and NO GO.

 

[Akshat]

Waste of money. Astra 3 and Uttam radar makes Rafale yesterday's technology.

And where is either of them?

 

[Akshat]

If India decides to do Rafales for MRFA (I have reservations) then Dassault must guarantee (with severe penalties) full TOT, F4 version and future upgrades, Indian weapons and sensor integration, domestic production (with indigenous suppliers) of at least 12 (1st year, rising to 18 and then 24 by year 3) within 3 years of contract signing and all planes in 5 years thereafter, on a fixed upfront price...I would suggest against 100% Dassault control, and require a JV say with TATAS of 49%, so we can have a long term player along with HAL...Of course Dassault will promise everything but we must be careful how we structure the contract and ensure not only commercial, but also technical, speed, cost guarantees including by the French Government (with TOT and Export Controls)....In the past we have done a poor job with Mirage 2000, Su-30 MKIs and we did not have a spine, hopefully now we do and must drive a good deal with national interest in mind.

1. Amount of ToT depends on how much we are ready to pay. ToT is never free. The more you are ready to pay, the more ToT can be achieved. However, 100% is rather difficult. Say, they won't give you the tech for M88, will they? Regarding penalties, France doesn't need them as their record for offsets and ToT is rather stellar in recent deals like Rafale and Scorpene.
2. Govt. recently allowed 100% FDI in defense to boost local production. They will have to create an Indian subsidiary which will be an Indian company for all practical reasons. The GoI must close this loophole for bigger projects. Even Saab is looking at this route. Having said that, DRDO does get all the tech transferred. But we must ensure a local participant.

 

[Akshat]

Bharat must reject this clever proposal of Dassault. This is a clear conspiracy of Dassault to keep all the technologies within the company based in Bharat. This will not boost any indigenous ecosystem in aerospace industry.Non starter . Better to order 36 Rafales and scrap MRFA for good. Keep focused on Tejas Mark-2 and AMCA.

It's not a conspiracy but a corporate move based on existing laws. GoI recently allowed 100% FDI in defense. Even Saab is said to be considering this route. So this is very much allowed by GoI itself. GoI must close off this loophole.

 

[Akshat]

wow Dassault a establihed player promising 25 jets per year production when they itself struggling to produce 15 per year , Second if India is Going to pay for ToT under Make in India how it will benefit if India pay for ToT since 100% ownership will b with Dassault in DRAL . There should b either Pvt Indian player stake Holder or it should b produce with HAL. if Dassault gets Full ownership of DRAL how Tech will b Transfered to India.

Well they promised 15 and reached 13. And are now making 2 per month, which is 24 per year. So not sure how that is 'struggling'. Barely a few months of delay in ramping up capacity. Almost 90% utilization. HAL isn't achieving even 35%.

 

[Akshat]

Just order another 36 Rafales and scrap the entire MRFA process. Concentrate on Tejas and AMCA.

HAL can't deliver even trainers ordered in 2013 till date. Forget AMCA and Mk2. So IAF should twiddle it's thumbs?

 

[ABHIJIT APSINGIKAR]

In Telugu we call this ruse - "Nakka Jitthulu" which means Fox tricks.

Dassault is trying every which way it can to avoid transferring any TOT or full production to India and its HAL since it won L1 bidder award. It reneged on all commitments put in winning L1 bidder status.
Do not fall for France/Dassault/Safran tricks at all.

Better to invest that $30+ billions massively in Indian own programs like Tejas IA, Tejas Mk2, TEDBF, and AMCA.

It must be a RED LINE and NO GO.

As of 2024, India allows full 100% FDI through government approval. They can officially either pick up remaining 25% stake in DRAL or make an independent proposal to set up a fully owned greenfield subsidiary. Either way, there would be no question of technology transfer as they have the option of acquiring controlling stake in venture even today.

 

[shivkumar sinha]

It's not a conspiracy but a corporate move based on existing laws. GoI recently allowed 100% FDI in defense. Even Saab is said to be considering this route. So this is very much allowed by GoI itself. GoI must close off this loophole.

Yes but beyond 74% , government nod is essential that depends on access to advanced technology.

FDI IN DEFENCE SECTOR

Defence Industry sector was opened up in May 2001 for private sector participation. Foreign Direct I

pib.gov.in

 

[NSR]

As of 2024, India allows full 100% FDI through government approval. They can officially either pick up remaining 25% stake in DRAL or make an independent proposal to set up a fully owned greenfield subsidiary. Either way, there would be no question of technology transfer as they have the option of acquiring controlling stake in venture even today.

114*$275 (with inflation adjustments) = $31.35 billions.
Speaks volumes about acquiring 4+ generation fighter without TOT for $31.35+ billions.

And then India will keep paying for spares and logistic services. etc through its nose for next few decades for sure.

Spend that amount on Indian fighters only.
Nothing ventured and nothing gained.

 

[Pramkumar]

Close this chapter of MMRCA / MRFA and invest the money into MK2 ORCA and AMCA and TEDBF

 

[shivkumar sinha]

It's not a conspiracy but a corporate move based on existing laws. GoI recently allowed 100% FDI in defense. Even Saab is said to be considering this route. So this is very much allowed by GoI itself. GoI must close off this loophole.

Yes but FDI upto only 74% is allowed automatically beyond which government approval is essential. Government can examine the case on merits based on access to advanced technology.

 

[Bhishma]

Bharat must reject this clever proposal of Dassault. This is a clear conspiracy of Dassault to keep all the technologies within the company based in Bharat. This will not boost any indigenous ecosystem in aerospace industry.Non starter . Better to order 36 Rafales and scrap MRFA for good. Keep focused on Tejas Mark-2 and AMCA.

We need to be prepared for new wave of East India Company. West is going to $hit, they are all looking to jump ship. They all want to come to India but also want to have the guarantee that they can pull out anytime they want.

 

[Bhishma]

This is detrimental in long run to India.
In the name of speed of production, India cannot lose private defense industries to foreign countries.
Especially this industry is with full of politics in the geopolitical arena

How is it going to be any worse ? We have long drawn defense projects that eventually lose out to foreign players. Might as well create jobs and technical knowhow within the country ?